Pre-bonsai Trees - this may be a dumb question, but...
- Thread starter BonSeidi Klum
- Start date
shinmai
Chumono
First, there are no dumb questions, only stupid answers.
As far as weird timing, I have a hinomaru that bloomed in August, so no, don’t be surprised when they bloom at unexpected times.
Repotting into “bonsai soil” [which for azaleas is a good idea, as long as it’s kanuma] is fine, depending on timing. Azaleas tend to adhere, broadly speaking, to the solar calendar. Even though you’re in Southern California, I would suggest that azaleas respond to the length of the daylight interval in deriving their metabolic activity. I firmly believe that the internet advice about repotting after blooming is idiocy. IMO, you should repot in late February/early March.
As far as weird timing, I have a hinomaru that bloomed in August, so no, don’t be surprised when they bloom at unexpected times.
Repotting into “bonsai soil” [which for azaleas is a good idea, as long as it’s kanuma] is fine, depending on timing. Azaleas tend to adhere, broadly speaking, to the solar calendar. Even though you’re in Southern California, I would suggest that azaleas respond to the length of the daylight interval in deriving their metabolic activity. I firmly believe that the internet advice about repotting after blooming is idiocy. IMO, you should repot in late February/early March.
BonSeidi Klum
Seedling
Ok i'll do that. Thank you!!
Deep Sea Diver
Imperial Masterpiece
Please ensure the roots and under trunk area are completely washed clean of the old media before planting in kanuma. Since you are in SoCal, it’s likely a good idea to use about 30% finely chopped, presoaked New Zealand sphagnum moss.
Cheers
DSD sends
Cheers
DSD sends
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
IMHO this depends a lot on the species and your climate. Some plants tolerate much wider repotting window while some seem to have definite times. Different climates = different times of year for successful repotting. Places with really hot summers or really cold winters may have reduced chances for repotting.
Also depends on how much root reduction is done during the repotting. Just combing out old soil and replacing with new is way different to chopping 80% of roots to fit into a new pot.
My experience is that azalea are very tolerant of repotting, at least where I live. I've dug and transplanted azaleas in all seasons and rarely lost one, even with massive root reduction.
Many azaleas have a tendency to repeat blooming. I have one that flowered off and on right through Spring, Summer and Autumn last year and currently has flowers opening at the very start of our Spring.
Azaleas here thrive in the same potting soil all my other trees are in. Maybe there's something special about kanuma, peat and sphagnum in some areas but my azaleas don't seem to have got that memo.
Deep Sea Diver
Imperial Masterpiece
A healthy azalea should be in bud by now unless it is a very late bloomer like Taiyo. Many azaleas toss off a bloom late, depending upon the light and temperature of the environment.
One can expect really good results when taking a healthy and robust azalea out of the landscape, cleaning the roots and potting it up given proper technique as @Shibui
However taking a healthy and robust potted azalea, root mentions.washing and potting it up in a different media can give less than optimal results if done outside the normal potting window. They can be a tad finicky, especially f9r first timers. Best to repot at the start of the growing year. This allows the remaining roots to recover (6-8 week) and gives the remainder of the year to build a strong root system and canopy.
Expect a healthy and robust azalea to need repotting or up potting in 1-2 years for the first round. As these plants age, repotting cycle goes to 3 years.
Water quality will likely be an issue in SoCal. Would recommend joining a local club, there are lots in SoCal. Ask these folks about their experiences and or solutions concerning water quality.
Cheers
DSD sends
One can expect really good results when taking a healthy and robust azalea out of the landscape, cleaning the roots and potting it up given proper technique as @Shibui
However taking a healthy and robust potted azalea, root mentions.washing and potting it up in a different media can give less than optimal results if done outside the normal potting window. They can be a tad finicky, especially f9r first timers. Best to repot at the start of the growing year. This allows the remaining roots to recover (6-8 week) and gives the remainder of the year to build a strong root system and canopy.
Expect a healthy and robust azalea to need repotting or up potting in 1-2 years for the first round. As these plants age, repotting cycle goes to 3 years.
Water quality will likely be an issue in SoCal. Would recommend joining a local club, there are lots in SoCal. Ask these folks about their experiences and or solutions concerning water quality.
Cheers
DSD sends
BonSeidi Klum
Seedling
This a great call out and I suspect is at least some of the reason I've had some issues. I first tried using adding some ferrous sulfate to filtered water but that didn't seem to work well. Am now trying just filtered water, but any suggestions would be great, as "collecting rainwater" isn't possible here in the desert.
Attmos
Chumono
Did I just hear you say your trees are in potting soil?
Deep Sea Diver
Imperial Masterpiece
First thing one has to quantify the issue. Some SoCal areas are better than others in water quality. First thing to do is find out who supplies ther water in your area, then go to their website and search for Water Quality Report. Most often a number of past years will pop up. Next search the two most recent for Carbonates (CaCO3) or TDS (Total Dissolved Solids) and also pH.
Next compare the Carbonates/TDS to a water hardness scale. If your water is between 80-100 or more likely you will have to treat it. Citric Acid is the best overall chelating agent imho. It’s cheap, easy to buy, relatively safe to handle and it doesn’t take a lot to soften the water. There are lots of resources to tell you how to do this, so I’ll avoid a perhaps lengthy explanation.
pH. Water companies usually push the pH to the alkaline side, about 7.8-8.0 to avoid corroding their pipes. Whatever you see on the report is your starting point.
To double check the chelation of the carbonates, check the pH. I highly recommend using an aquarium pH test kit for starters. These are easy to use and inexpensive.
So…. As these water gets softer the carbonates get tied up, the pH will shift more and more to the acid side. 7.0 is a good target. Might even take it down to 6.8 or 6.6 for the first month or so of watering. This will help tie up any existing carbonates in the media. Then use 7.0.
Hope this helps. Cheers
DSD sends
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
I use the same potting mix for all trees, so yes, Azaleas are in potting soil. What else would you grow plants in?
Attmos
Chumono
Well, everyone's always talking about Akadama, Pumice, etc......
No one here ever recommends potting soil, at least not that I remember.
We don't talk about it because it's heresyWell, everyone's always talking about Akadama, Pumice, etc......
No one here ever recommends potting soil, at least not that I remember.
Attmos
Chumono
Cheaper is good.
I just discovered NAPA part# 8822 Diatomaceous Earth, they sell 24 qts. for $15.00 U.S..
So I'm gonna get some of that tomorrow if NAPA is open.
Deep Sea Diver
Imperial Masterpiece
Interesting. This explains a lot about azalea survival when repotting.
Hmm…. Your trees, your choice.
Oh boy! Getting out the popcorn and preparing for potential Soil Wars fun!
Cheers
DSD sends
Attmos
Chumono
Ok, lay it on me... what are the downsides of diatomaceous earth? lol
Deep Sea Diver
Imperial Masterpiece
Just an observer here…. So I’ll weigh in only once.
Plenty of upsides of DE….But would start with difficulty getting good particle size DE in US. Many reports of 8822 have varying amounts of useable media from 1/2 to 1/4.
Best
DSD sends
Plenty of upsides of DE….But would start with difficulty getting good particle size DE in US. Many reports of 8822 have varying amounts of useable media from 1/2 to 1/4.
Best
DSD sends
Attmos
Chumono
Yeah I could imagine, because it's just used to clean up oil, that the bags have a lot of crushed material in them. I'm sure being transported here and there, the bags being thrown around, stacked highly.... none of that helps.
Attmos
Chumono
Ok.... you're making the distinction between 'tree', 'shrub', 'succulent', 'vine', etc... and each type are given the same mix...
Is that what you're hinting at? I suppose I should already know that.
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Not quite everyone and not quite no-one. There are still a few of us that persist with organic potting mixes. Especially those with hotter, drier Summers. maybe we just don't keep banging on about it all the time.Well, everyone's always talking about Akadama, Pumice, etc......
No one here ever recommends potting soil, at least not that I remember.
I think if you read through some of the potting soil threads you'll find that I am not the only dinosaur but it has been a while since we had a really good potting soil thread. They used to get quite heated at times.
